Ep. 29: Todd Anderson – Optimizing Sleep for Maximum Recovery

00:00:00
Speaker 1: So I usually, like if I’m going straight for performance stuff, I do sauna usually by itself at night before bed, and then if I do contrast, yeah, I’ll pair it up.

00:00:10
Speaker 2: But the cold, I.

00:00:12
Speaker 1: Think the cold is probably the most misused thing. And there’s also like all this it’s funny that you know the studies about lifting and not doing clunch right after. I mean that originally came out in two thousand and nine. That’s like not new new science, and it makes sense. It’s like you know, you you you apply the stimulus to your body, your body of your acts creates inflammation and that’s how you get stronger. Yeah, Like it’s not this like crazy thought. So you know, it’s one of those tools. I think people just they don’t They’re not intentional with it. It’s not like a yes or no thing. It’s a horrible wind thing. Same with sauna. But I just think people just kind of just do whatever out here.

00:00:52
Speaker 3: The steaks are real effective Preparation starts with fitness, but it requires so much more.

00:01:00
Speaker 4: Explores the tools, knowledge, resilience, and skills needed to be ready when it matters the most. Join me Rich Browning as we apply the decades of wisdom I’ve gained through training and competition to hunting in the back hunting. This is in Pursuit brought to you by Mouth Knocks.

00:01:22
Speaker 2: In collaboration with Mayhem Hunt.

00:01:25
Speaker 5: We got a guest Todd Anderson.

00:01:27
Speaker 3: We have Scott van der Slut, who’s been here you’re regular now, usually behind the camera, but he’s made his face onto the show a couple of times. Todd Michigan State linebacker.

00:01:38
Speaker 2: Full back, full back. The good guys.

00:01:41
Speaker 5: I thought you were a linebacker.

00:01:42
Speaker 2: I mean it’s kind of the same thing.

00:01:44
Speaker 3: Yeah, well, yeah, I guess I was want to say, full.

00:01:49
Speaker 5: Backs are kind of making it come back to it.

00:01:51
Speaker 2: Yeah, renaissance, I have made fullbacks great again.

00:01:55
Speaker 5: Yeah that’s cool.

00:01:57
Speaker 3: Yeah, So I mean you’re trying to see that come back a little bit. Feel like the NFL just kind of cycles through stuff.

00:02:02
Speaker 1: I mean everything everything works, you know, like all the offensive work, it’s just and then it’s like when you do something different, it works better. So I feel like you’ll start to see a trickle around. It works for a long time.

00:02:12
Speaker 5: To h it’s just a lot of weard tear on everybody, right.

00:02:14
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it’s fine. And the guy that’s willing to do it. Yeah.

00:02:17
Speaker 3: I mean we’re both Lions fans too, So Scott is from Michigan.

00:02:20
Speaker 5: Let’s go, we’re not a Lions fan.

00:02:22
Speaker 2: Are you? Are you green? Are you blue?

00:02:25
Speaker 5: Blue?

00:02:26
Speaker 2: I mean yeah, you guys see, things are going great right now. Values somehow.

00:02:34
Speaker 6: It’s still going better though than when I grew up, is it? Well, things were good with Lloyd Carr.

00:02:41
Speaker 2: It was the period between that’s when I was there. Yeah, every year.

00:02:44
Speaker 6: The period between Lloyd Carr and Jim Harbaugh was rich. There was I think there was one other one I’ve I’ve blacked it out.

00:02:59
Speaker 5: But yeah, that was a rough time. But you think it’s worse then than it is right now?

00:03:04
Speaker 1: Yeah, your coach just got rest, Like you had, like values and morals and stuff.

00:03:11
Speaker 6: Just get a new coach.

00:03:12
Speaker 5: Whole thing’s fixt you think that or you think eighty I mean they’re doing like a whole.

00:03:17
Speaker 6: I’m not worried about it. Michigan State just went through this somewhat. Yeah, the arrests, Yeah, but like the full like eighty top to bottom.

00:03:26
Speaker 1: Yeah, No, I mean it’s been we went from like the worst of the worst and now it’s like whoa, all of a sudden it couldn’t be better, like as far.

00:03:33
Speaker 5: As the potential wise potential.

00:03:35
Speaker 1: Yeah, I’m pumped, befo. It’s my number one pick of all coaches.

00:03:39
Speaker 3: So my nephew plays at Northwestern and got he loved loved him. Yeah, and uh, it’s kind of crazy because he’s a huge Michigan State kid, went to Northwestern, had been offered to Michigan State. He’s a linebacker, got offered to Northwestern and loved Fitzgerald.

00:03:57
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:03:57
Speaker 1: And then he’s just a gritty guy, like we need like a gritty you know, like make the most out of what we have, like mentality, Like that’s kind of like the culture.

00:04:04
Speaker 5: I didn’t realize he went there. So yeah, that’s that’s crazy because.

00:04:07
Speaker 1: And then my best friend from college, Max Bullet, just got hired as the co decordinator and he was a linebacker mid linebacker when I was there, So I’m hypy about that. He was a linebacker coach at Notre Dame. But yeah, he’s a savage.

00:04:18
Speaker 5: That’s cool.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, So you know, I would you’re doing a lot of things now, but one of the big things and what we kind of uh, I thought we’d talked through and you know, recovery is a big thing that you’re pushing doing a lot of that, and sleep.

00:04:34
Speaker 5: You got some The sleep tape still distresses me out.

00:04:39
Speaker 3: Yeah, that’s okay, but now I have The sauna is something that since we did You’ve Got to Beat the Heat podcast, where you basically torture people in the sauna and do a podcast and then you try to keep your wits about you and then talk, which is surprisingly hard.

00:04:55
Speaker 5: You think it wouldn’t be that hard.

00:04:57
Speaker 2: It’s it’s always harder than people think.

00:04:58
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, but I’ve man, that’s something that Yeah, I got got a son from Pete at CSU right after that, and you know, in the summer, it was hard for me to get in that rhythm just because it’s so hot.

00:05:11
Speaker 5: But man, now that I’ve gotten in that rhythm, I’ll maintain it.

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Speaker 3: I go, you know, first thing in the morning for twenty five minutes and then straight into the cold for three.

00:05:18
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:05:18
Speaker 3: And dude, yesterday I was I’ve been sick the last couple of days. I did three cycles of that. Good man, you’re sick. Yeah, it’s like a natural fever, Yeah, it really is.

00:05:26
Speaker 2: It kind of breaks it all. Pete’s the best too.

00:05:28
Speaker 1: Yeah, just like you know, there’s a lot of brands out there, but it’s always great when you get somebody you want to support.

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Speaker 5: Well, yeah, he’s you.

00:05:34
Speaker 3: Know, authentic to it and into fitness and into what we’re doing. So yeah, I think we’re they’re actually going to partner with us on our four to forty challenge for the beginning.

00:05:41
Speaker 5: Of the year. Oh so these guys are wanting to put in for the sauna too.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it’s like the one fitness thing too. I feel like people buy treadmills and bite all this stuff. It’s like the one thing you continue to look forward to, like, oh infinitely and after people always get their money’s worth every single time.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, yeah, because you actually want.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, you like it.

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Speaker 1: It’s like enjoyable, and it’s like it’s rare to find something that’s like good for you and like enjoyable and not hard. And that’s like one of the singular things.

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Speaker 5: What’s nice and sleep.

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Speaker 6: I always said that whenever we went, whenever we did contrast, the first the only part that you ays like feels like work is maybe the last five minutes of your first sauna. After that, it’s the whole thing is fairly enjoyable.

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Speaker 2: Yeah for sure. Yeah, that’s exactly what I was gonna say.

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Speaker 5: It was like the first couple minutes of the sauna.

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Speaker 3: What I like about is in the morning, you don’t want to go do anything Like I tried to get into the routine and going straight into cold and you just can’t do it.

00:06:33
Speaker 1: I did that for like two years, like pretty you know, it was like a thing.

00:06:37
Speaker 2: I did.

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Speaker 5: You feel like you had got the plunge. It’s like, yeah, I’ll do it. I’ll it’ll be a hard ass.

00:06:41
Speaker 1: And then I was like, man, I’m like stressed waking up. I don’t want to feel like every morning.

00:06:46
Speaker 2: I’m like oh yeah.

00:06:48
Speaker 1: And then and then I think the science evolved and it was like, Okay, you don’t have to do this thing.

00:06:52
Speaker 2: It’s still good. There’s there’s time and place, but it’s not every morning time.

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Speaker 6: Right last year and two years ago, before our third season Rifle Hunt, I knew it was going to be cold out and so I would try to consistently cold plunge like cold like don’t get asana as if. I was like training my body to be more comfortable in the cold. I don’t know if it.

00:07:11
Speaker 5: Worked, right, Yeah, I’m not sure if they’re science to back that.

00:07:13
Speaker 6: That was my third season rifle preparation.

00:07:15
Speaker 1: Well, on Finland, they like leave their their because I went to Finland, we did like twenty five sonas in seven days. But they like leave their infants outside for like an hour to get them used to the cold when they’re have them sleep out there.

00:07:28
Speaker 6: Sometimes that happened to me as a kid.

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Speaker 2: Intentionally or unintentionally.

00:07:33
Speaker 6: I’ve been told unintentionally.

00:07:34
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, yeah, that makes sense.

00:07:36
Speaker 6: I got a little bit of frostbit on my cheeks.

00:07:38
Speaker 2: Where in Michigan be from.

00:07:39
Speaker 6: From about an hour north of Grand Rapids.

00:07:42
Speaker 1: Okay, so I’m from Jackson, so yeah, yeah, so we dou yeah yeah open here.

00:07:50
Speaker 5: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: So you know, I think the I’ve kind of changed my morning routine to get up thirty minutes earlier to keep doing it.

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Speaker 5: So it’s it’s something that I really enjoyed it at night right now, it’s hard with the kids.

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Speaker 3: Actually, Dude, my son loves like he’ll get up and if I’m not if he doesn’t see it, I’m not around, he’ll come down there and I’m letting him. I’m like, you get ten minutes, like you can be in there for ten minutes or like he’s not almost not yeah, and so he’s he’s fine. It’s hilarious though. He loves it.

00:08:19
Speaker 1: Yeah, No, I mean I used to love it as a kid. That’s how I like originally liked on it was my dad was a wrestling coach. Oh okay, and we would go we would go to hotels, you know, and the guys would be cutting weight. It wasn’t allowed, but you know, you’d look the other way, and I would just love going in there. And then it just kind of I’ve been sonning consistently, like since twenty fifteen, like to four to seven times a week or whatever, So thank you.

00:08:42
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean I’ve been doing it now for probably five or six months. And man, yeah, like the days when we travel and we’re not around one, I’m like, gosh, this sucks.

00:08:50
Speaker 5: It’s also just so used to it.

00:08:51
Speaker 2: Mentally, it’s just nice too.

00:08:52
Speaker 1: It kind of just feels like a bubble you can detach and just kind of let everything go. Your phone gets too hot, right, and just zwing out a little bit.

00:09:00
Speaker 3: I’ve kind of figured out that if I put mine down by the door, it’ll stay cool. Yeah, either listen and you know, I’ll do a podcast or listen to a sermon or something like that. So it’s a good like quiet time in the morning to get in get in the word. So but yeah, so you know I go sauna. Do you cold punch too?

00:09:15
Speaker 2: Yeah? Yeah, right after it depends.

00:09:18
Speaker 1: I mean so I usually, like if I’m going straight for performance stuff, I do sauna usually by itself at night before bed, and then if I do contrast, yeah, I’ll pair it up. But the cold, I think that the cold is probably the most misused thing. Yeah, and there’s also like all this it’s funny that you know, the studies about lifting and not doing cold punch right after. I mean that originally came out in two thousand and nine. That’s like not new new science, and it makes sense. It’s like you know, you you you apply the stimulus to your body, your body, your axe creates inflammation.

00:09:52
Speaker 2: And that’s how you get strong.

00:09:53
Speaker 1: Yeah, like it it’s not this like crazy thought. And so you know, it’s one of those tools. I think people just they don’t they’re not with it. It’s not like a yes or no thing. It’s a more of a wind thing. Same with sauna. But I just think people just kind.

00:10:06
Speaker 5: Of just do whatever now why do you say do it at night?

00:10:09
Speaker 1: I mean, so with sleep, So sauna, you know, there there’s two sides of it, right, Like there’s the sleep benefits, uh, and then there’s like the longevity performance benefits, and and you know, I look at them kind of separate. And so from the sleep side, the main factor is just warming your body up. So it can be sauna, it can be hot shower, hot whatever, hot bath, But just like applying heat before bed, you know, your body reacts and because in order to fall asleep, you got to drop your core temperature like a degree degree and a half, and so when you apply heat with that reaction, your body cools down faster more efficiently. And then you you know, if you walk into a cold bedroom or you have an eight sleeper a mattress topper, then all of a sudden, it’s a pretty rapid decrease in temperature and you tend to pass out fast. Yeah, So temperature is like, you know, as far as things we can control, temperature is probably one of the easiest, most overlooked things with sleep, right, not only just having a cool room, but also having heat in some sense before you go to bed.

00:11:03
Speaker 5: Yeah, I run hot for sure, before.

00:11:05
Speaker 2: Do you use any Do you have a mattress?

00:11:07
Speaker 5: I don’t have a mattress. We had we had eight Sleep for a while and it started leaking.

00:11:10
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, it was a bad way. We got a lot better.

00:11:12
Speaker 1: Yeah, there’s a couple of other brands, but that I mean that one like those Yeah, those are games.

00:11:16
Speaker 5: I mean I’ve heard great things.

00:11:17
Speaker 3: I just we just have not. I’ve not gotten back into it. My wife she we were completely different on temperature wise, like I run hot.

00:11:25
Speaker 2: Well that’s what’s nice is now they’re separate. Yeah.

00:11:28
Speaker 5: That was a big thing too.

00:11:29
Speaker 3: It was like I remember the first time I got the eight Sleep I was like, I’ll put it on ten negative.

00:11:33
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, people don’t realize. They think like negative ten air temperature. You’re like shivering, dude.

00:11:41
Speaker 3: It was like those times when you’re asleep and you’re so cold but you don’t want to get up to getting shirt or something.

00:11:46
Speaker 5: You sleep terrible.

00:11:47
Speaker 2: It’s actually like super uncomfortable and it’s too cold like that. It’s horrible. Yeah, Yeah, it’s it’s nice.

00:11:51
Speaker 1: I mean it’s nice too because now they it detects your body heat and even for like females if they have like a hot flash.

00:11:57
Speaker 2: It will rapidly jump the temperature down. And so there’s it. I mean, the technology is coming a long way.

00:12:03
Speaker 5: It’s cool. I need to check it out again. After that, we.

00:12:05
Speaker 6: Kind of got a natural experience with it’s sleep negative ten. When we were in Oklahoma hunting with Clay last year, it was so cold. We had like fifty degree sleeping bags. They were just in a tepee tent and it was under thirty I want to say, for for the whole trip pretty much, and we had yeah, we didn’t have bags for it.

00:12:26
Speaker 5: Bibbs.

00:12:27
Speaker 6: Yeah, so we were sleeping.

00:12:28
Speaker 2: Do you sleep well?

00:12:29
Speaker 5: R Now? I slept over first night.

00:12:31
Speaker 2: Sometimes you sleep better than you think when you were first night.

00:12:33
Speaker 3: No second night, I was like, Bibbs and my thick jacket basically what I hunted and I slept in and it was fine.

00:12:39
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:12:40
Speaker 6: Yeah. My bottom player of clothes like never never were removed from my body for three days.

00:12:46
Speaker 5: Yeah, like like I didn’t even.

00:12:48
Speaker 6: I didn’t even swap him to close out. Yeah, yeah, it was pretty.

00:12:52
Speaker 3: I thought you were going to talk about wyoming when we would start a fire that too, Like ye saw on a level hot in this tent and then you’d wake up at two am and the fire was out, so it’d be like thirty degrees.

00:13:03
Speaker 1: That’s tough hot, I mean possible, and your body can’t. Like it’s just the science of it too. It’s not like just a mental thing. Your body has to cool down.

00:13:13
Speaker 5: I can’t do it for sure, all right, So we talk temperature.

00:13:17
Speaker 1: I think about it back as we evolved, like the ground was the first eight sleep, it would cool down, it was. That’s kind of how it works. So it makes sense that we’re adapted to that.

00:13:27
Speaker 3: So temperature is a big thing you can control when you’re trying to get some sleep. Yeah, what’s the next thing?

00:13:32
Speaker 1: I mean, I mean the I think the biggest thing that of all the sleep stuff out there, I think there’s two things that really play the biggest role. One is from from like a science or data perspective. The consistency exist like the time you wake up, the time you go to bed seven days a week, that will that will fix ninety five percent of sleep issues.

00:13:49
Speaker 2: I think. You know, sometimes people tell themselves stories about.

00:13:52
Speaker 1: The weekends or what time they normally get up, But you know, when you really lock in to a consistent schedule, you’re not you know when you control your feeing your alcohol. Things are usually fall into place. But then the piece it’s overlooked is like the mindset aspect. I think a lot of times when people ask me about sleep issues, right, they’re waking up in the middle of the night, all these different things going on, a lot of times it has to do with stress management, and honestly, like the purpose they have in their life, what’s going on in their life, you know, what are they doing career wise, faith what you know? Everything involved their family. Like when you’re waking in the middle of the night and you have anxiety and thinking about stuff over and over again, Like, that’s not a sleep problem, that’s a stress management And so I always tell people, I mean, the best sleepers are people that have purpose in their life. They have community, they have family, and a lot of times sleep is just the mirror that people look into and they figure out they need to, you know, take a look at their life and address some things going on.

00:14:47
Speaker 2: Right, So it’s kind of a good thing.

00:14:48
Speaker 1: But I think what happens is people think, oh, I can’t sleep well, and they and that’s that’s a hard process.

00:14:53
Speaker 5: Obviously, Then you start anxiety and spend.

00:14:55
Speaker 1: That’s a hard process, and so people start to turn to the quick fixes, the supplements, sleep medication, all that stuff. But the mindset surrounding sleep, you know, sleep needs to be something like you know, it’s the ultimate form of peace. So you need to be in a place, a mental place to relax and you know, create the environment to relax. And if you can’t do that, you you start really doing a deep top of why that is. The other thing is too is like you you know, along the same in the same breadth of that purpose stuff.

00:15:24
Speaker 2: It’s like, you need to figure out what.

00:15:26
Speaker 1: You want to do with your life where you’re working hard, you’re active, like you’re tired at night, like you’re you’re doing.

00:15:31
Speaker 2: Things that you’re inspired to do.

00:15:32
Speaker 1: Because when you’re physically active, mentally active, and you feel purpose like, you should be tired, like should be tired and want to go to bed. And you know, that’s why a lot of times the first suggestion I make to people is activity. Like exercise is probably the most underrated sleep tool there is. Up until last year, like end of last year, people would even talk about, well, you don’t want to work out too close today kind of ramps and nervous system up a new study came out. Essentially exercise was net positive whether time, tensity, long intensity.

00:16:01
Speaker 2: Right before bed, like an hour before bed morning.

00:16:04
Speaker 1: It’s interesting your body adapts, Like if you do different types of exercise, you actually get different types of sleep cycles sleep ram sleep. But like you know, if you’re looking to fix one thing, start moving around and your sleep usually gets better.

00:16:17
Speaker 3: Yeah, he ca Yeah, so you know, one of the main things we try to do is keep a relatively similar sleep cycle even when the kids are out of school.

00:16:26
Speaker 5: That seems to have helped. Where are you at on like melatonin or anything like that.

00:16:31
Speaker 2: I mean melatone and is stuff. It’s like one it’s most countries.

00:16:37
Speaker 1: It’s a prescription and it’s one of those things our body naturally produces it. And I think the reason I always shy away from it is because I think people look at as a quick fix. But if you can control the light, you know what type of light exposure you have, mimic the sunlight. Most people can produce enough melotone, Like, that’s not the limiting factor of somebody’s sleep, it’s everything else outside of that. The other thing they’re finding out is when people take melatone in they have like super physiological levels in the morning oftentimes, so that means essentially you’re taking it a lot of the doses are really high in these supplements, and then you still have more melotone in your system in the morning than you would naturally produce even at night, and then that results on decreased performance the next morning. So it’s you know, when you look at the data on it two that the benefits on the sleep.

00:17:22
Speaker 2: Side are really minimal.

00:17:24
Speaker 1: And you know, the behavior stuff, the stuff we’re talking about like the heat, the mindset, the temperature, that is way more impactful long term.

00:17:31
Speaker 5: Yeah.

00:17:31
Speaker 3: I actually, uh, I take three milligrams I have for like I got up to when I was competing around ten.

00:17:37
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I don’t do that three now, and I mean it just turned out pretty good.

00:17:43
Speaker 3: Yeah all right, Yeah, so I mean like three for me, I think it’s placebo.

00:17:49
Speaker 5: You know, if I like don’t take it.

00:17:51
Speaker 3: Or if I think I didn’t take it, yeah, then I’m like.

00:17:55
Speaker 2: And if you think it works, it usually works. Yeah.

00:17:58
Speaker 1: But there’s not a lot of negative data on it, you know. But it’s one of those things it’s like you probably probably don’t need it. It’s probably not doing what you think it is right, right, I.

00:18:05
Speaker 6: Only take it when we out hunt. It’s the only time because I have I have no sleep problems. Like at home, I fall asleep really fast, like in seconds. I feel like that’s and I sleep through the night, wake up, I feel energized. But when we out hunt, whether it’s like I’m excited to be there, I’m like thinking about the hunt constantly, and you’re usually like on mentally and physically up until like the second you’re getting ready to go to bed. And I’ll take it when we out hunt because it just like shuts me down instantly, like artificially. I guess, yeah, And I don’t even know. I’ve never actually, I guess hunted other than our first year without it, so I don’t know if it’s actually helping anything. But that’s the only time I take it, and it will like really shut me down fast.

00:18:51
Speaker 1: And I think that’s like that would be a good use case, you know, having it, having it available if you think you need it and you feel like you’re not gonna be able to sleep, well, it’s also good if you’re time zones a bunch, you know, it can kind of you can kind of create that natural sleep cycle or let that natural rise of melatonin artificially, like if you’re traveling internationally whatever. So there’s definitely uses for it, and some people use it and have great results, but like, you know, stay away from all the stuff out there. It’s definitely not the first thing you should address.

00:19:17
Speaker 3: Right, No, we were talking about this twenty four hour We do a couple of twenty four hour events throughout the year. Two Scott usually films one and then participates in the other.

00:19:31
Speaker 2: And so are you are you rowing?

00:19:33
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, yeah, so you know that’s that that’s a whole probably twenty four our whole sleep cycle, miss.

00:19:39
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:19:40
Speaker 5: And so that’s tough to it takes a couple of days to kind of rebound.

00:19:42
Speaker 1: From the Oh yeah, I mean you’re you’re getting deep into it and you’re and you’re like you’re layering on performance with it, so you’re.

00:19:49
Speaker 3: Yeah, man, it’s hard to fall asleep on those, you know. And it is the same, but it’s not the same what Scott’s talking about. Like when you are out that country or doing whatever, like your mind is going all all day, you are thinking about what you got to do the next day, and so you know, we always tell guys to be in the best shape going out, because once you get out there, there’s so many factors you can’t control. And so, you know, what are all the things that we can do before that you’re saying, you know, get in a good rhythm, you know, the temperature, those types of things, and so because once you get out there, you just can’t rely on getting good sleep.

00:20:26
Speaker 1: And the healthier you are too, like from a fitness level, weight weight management, all that stuff, like you’re going to just be sleeping better in general. Right, So I think you know that sets you up for more success as you get out there, because it’s going to be you know, it’s not gonna be ideal.

00:20:38
Speaker 5: Yeah.

00:20:38
Speaker 2: Yeah, so it’s like you got to you got to do your best to prep for it.

00:20:42
Speaker 5: Yeah, I think you know.

00:20:43
Speaker 3: The there’s if there’s one thing that affects me, like recovery wise, it’s sleep. You know, Like if I don’t get good sleep for multiple days, I’m either getting sick, which I am now, or I’m getting injured.

00:20:56
Speaker 2: What was your sleep like back like when you’re competing.

00:20:58
Speaker 3: Oh, man, I would go to sleep eight probably nine o’clockish, and I would just wake up whenever my body would get up like I wouldn’t set an alarm. I wasn’t one of those. It’s like, oh I got to get up at six before the enemy or five before me or whatever. I was just like no, because I mean.

00:21:12
Speaker 1: I mean you are you are also the guy that would go route nine pansy exactly what.

00:21:18
Speaker 6: You wake up then if you didn’t set an alarm.

00:21:20
Speaker 5: No, it’d be like eight sometimes nine.

00:21:22
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, your volume.

00:21:25
Speaker 5: Was like is huge.

00:21:26
Speaker 2: I was curious, do you remember, like during the games what your sleep is like? Were you able to sleep? Because I feel like it was one where or the other.

00:21:31
Speaker 5: One at the games.

00:21:33
Speaker 3: Man, You’re just your nerves are shot the whole time, so you’re just basically you know, yeah, no, heck no. My brain was always going thinking about what was next, what we were doing.

00:21:42
Speaker 2: So it was more like a mental like you were.

00:21:43
Speaker 5: Like, yeah, yeah, physically, yeah, of course.

00:21:45
Speaker 1: Sometimes when it’s like that level of exertion, you also don’t sleep well.

00:21:49
Speaker 5: Yeah.

00:21:49
Speaker 3: No, I did not sleep well ever really at the games or even a couple of weeks leading up to it. But I mean the more, you know, the more I got into it and the more I got used to it over the years, Like when I first started competing, you know, probably a month, month and a half out, I’d start getting super nervous, and then like two or three years in, I would be like, you know, two weeks out, I’d start getting nervous and getting bad sleep, and then towards the end it was like up until the last night.

00:22:17
Speaker 1: I’m curious, like if you went like everything you’ve learned since then, like if you went back, what protocols, like, what would you change, Like from recovery perspective.

00:22:25
Speaker 5: Oh man, I mean be nice to have a sana and a cold plunge. I think doing.

00:22:29
Speaker 3: More rehabish prehabish type exercises, just getting right into you know, doing met coons and doing whatever. Yeah, I mean there’s a lot of things. But also I don’t think if you change all that stuff.

00:22:41
Speaker 5: Then yeah, you know, we wouldn’t be here today. You know, like you just got to learn some of that stuff kind of on your own.

00:22:48
Speaker 2: And it was a different time.

00:22:49
Speaker 3: It was different time. Yeah, yeah, way different time. Yeah, you didn’t have all this stuff readily avail.

00:22:52
Speaker 2: But you know like how it’s like it’s like everywhere you go a.

00:22:55
Speaker 3: Row it was the only like machine you had to you know, now, we got all these other machines, so you can do all this other stuff.

00:23:02
Speaker 6: So well, even then, it wasn’t common practice to sauna and cold plut No. Heck no, like you saying back in twenty fifteen, that was you.

00:23:10
Speaker 2: Were probably hard to find.

00:23:11
Speaker 6: Yeah, you were an early adapter.

00:23:13
Speaker 1: Yeah, it was super hard to find. But those those landmark studies came out around that time. I think they were twenty twenty fifteen, those forty year long, you know, studies from from Europe in the long some of the longevity statisticals.

00:23:27
Speaker 5: Like some of the what are some of the statistics?

00:23:29
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean so what’s cool is like, you know, it’s so it’s so ingrained in their culture. Yeah, like you know, I spent a week there, and but there’s some things about the studies.

00:23:37
Speaker 2: I think we mess up here in the States.

00:23:39
Speaker 1: But you know, just people who are doing sauna consistently for seven times a week, forty percent drop and all cause mortality. So you think about things like heart disease, cancer essentially just a reduction in disease across the board. You know, some some really good mental health outcome stuff like twenty five percent reduction depression, chances of depression in order to neurodegenera diseases were down twenty five percent, like Alzheimer’s dementia. So like all the things you’re concerned about with aging, Yeah, sauna helps.

00:24:09
Speaker 6: And how much time when you say four to seven times a week, how much time are they exposed?

00:24:12
Speaker 1: Yeah, so the minimums. You know, Like I said, there’s not that many studies. I think people try to get super granular with this and it’s just something we need more time on. But sauna’s dose dependent, and so what that means is just the more you do it, the better it is.

00:24:25
Speaker 2: So the people who did.

00:24:26
Speaker 1: One time a week had of worse outcomes, and the people did two, they did three. And so the goal is four to seven times a week at least one hundred and seventy six degrees for twenty minutes, which isn’t that’s not too hard to do. And ideally the other thing with that is it’s better if you’re going to do four times a week doing it every other day rather than four times in a row because a lot of the benefits they think come from these heat shock proteins they get released from the heat, like they did these studies on worms and essentially they apply, you know, put a bunch of heat on these wor these heat shock proteins are released and they live almost twice as long. So that kind of got the ball rolling with the longevity stuff. But you the heat shock proteins last about twenty four hours, so you want those levels high consistently. So if you spread your if you can only do every other day, that’s better than lumping your four days together. So it’s kind of like the more the better, and it’s all like net positive. The only negative is like you know, for for guys, the reason our desticles are outside of our body is to keep them cool. Yes, and so so like you know, my wife just got pregnant. We’ve been to this whole last last week, this whole IBF journey. But you know, i’d have to put an ice pack on my ball. So when I’d go into Sawa and it’s crazy the numbers, dude, it changed it significantly from doing that. And so but the cool thing is like it’s it’s it’s one of those things that’s enjoyable. It helps a variety of things, it’s easy to do, and it’s pretty much no negative outcomes from it other than that, like which is, you know, it’s more on the sperm count side. So it’s not that big a deal if you’re not trying to actually have kids. But yeah, it’s it’s a it’s a rare thing that’s easy to do. I mean, sleeping song I always put together. It’s easy to do. It’s it’s really good for you. It’s not difficult. It’s easy to be consistent with. Like eating good is hard, difficult, challenging, working out is hard. You know, for most people, those two things are like low hanging fruit.

00:26:22
Speaker 6: Now where does the sleep tape come in?

00:26:24
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean so yeah, especially for guys. You know, I think.

00:26:30
Speaker 1: The evolution of the science on airways has changed quite a bit. The most common ailments from sleep come from breathing issues, Like you know, your airway collapses, you snore, You’re just not having efficient, efficient oxygen oxygen flow like to the brain and so like with you know, app sleep happening is probably one of the most underdiagnosed things out there. Snoring is a big symptom of that. It’s all that means is essentially your body is not getting a constant flow of oxygen, and so what can we do to create a better air flow? Environment. So that’s what the natal strips. The nail strips are the easy for people. We we like redesigned nail strips from top to the bottom.

00:27:03
Speaker 2: Breathe right.

00:27:04
Speaker 1: It’s been around forever, so we got patents. Took us eighteen months to redesign these things. But they’re great because the super low risk opens up your nose. And you know about three quarters of the population have a debate adccept them. And so you just don’t have efficient airflow through one side of your nose. And so if you can open that up a little bit, allow less resistance to your nose, a lot of times, you breathe better, you don’t snore or consistent oxygen, and you sleep a lot better. Like that’s one of the biggest issues with sleep, especially with guys. And the heavy you are, the bigger you are, the bigger your neck, the higher chances of sleep apnea. So I had mild sleep apniet. Like as I went down this path, I had no idea that I had it. I started taping my mouth.

00:27:40
Speaker 3: I was about to say, okay, so there’s different open nail strips, yeah, and then tape your mouth shut the world I can get behind the natal strip.

00:27:48
Speaker 5: Yeah, taping my mouth shut is the one that I’m like, I don’t know if you can do that.

00:27:51
Speaker 1: Well, it’s not that crazy. I mean it’s it’s definitely seems crazy.

00:27:55
Speaker 5: It’s weird, but it’s not. Yeah, you’re not like when I say this, it’s.

00:27:58
Speaker 1: Literally just like yeah, little one vertical. We have big ones too, But it’s not. It’s the science of it’s not that crazy, but the thought of it is everyone thinks that. Everyone’s like, this is freaking me out. But the goals is to breathe through your nose. If you think about like animals, every single animal, think about it. A deer when they’re sprinting, they’re never bringing out of their mouth. Like our noses are built to breathe, Like that’s what they’re designed for, and so it’s the most efficient way to breathe. A lot of things happen we breathe through our nose, like we warm the air, we create, nitric oxide goes into your lungs, or relax with your cardiovasco system. Makes you more efficient, and that’s that’s that’s the way.

00:28:33
Speaker 2: You utilize auction the best.

00:28:35
Speaker 1: Because the other thing that happens when you breathe out of your mouth all the time, which plays a huge role in endurance of performance is you’re getting rid of all the CO two, which is good, Like when you’re in the middle of a workout, like you want to get rid of that CO two, But in the night, you actually want your body to get tolerant to that CO two. You want to have low levels. You don’t want to constantly be at zero CO two in your system because that they call it CO two tolerance dictates like your thirst to So when you get in an environment, a stressful workout environment, and your CO two levels start to go up, if your body’s not trained to be used to that CO two, you’re gonna have more of a stress response, You’re gonna have more.

00:29:10
Speaker 2: With us to breathe.

00:29:11
Speaker 1: Overbreaths start like hyperventilating, and so part of it is just training yourself to be used to handling stress. And I think a lot of people over breathe even walking around, Like if you’re not doing high level of exertion, you should be breathing out of your nose even if you’re doing like Zone two all that stuff. And so the tape is just an easy way to make sure you’re breathing through your nose. Obviously we’re on constant and we’re sleeping, and so it’s a quick fix. And so I always tell people, you know, there’s certain things that people over a certain BMI, but everyone should get a sleep study done. There’s at home sleep studies like two hundred bucks. They’re super easy because if you have a sleep app mean, like the long term outcomes of that are not good, especially for your brain, brain in your heart, Like you’re kind of destroying your brain in your heart.

00:29:51
Speaker 2: So make sure you’re on something serious going on. And then you know, if.

00:29:55
Speaker 1: You’re trying to go from ninety percent to one hundred, start playing around with it made a significant difference for me kind of how it all started. It was just you know, trout and air on my side and learning more about it. That was like seven years ago, and that’s kind of a bolt into all this different stuff. But we don’t try to like push push it or anything. But it’s crazy the impact and it’s actually crazy, you know, with some high level athletes we work with, like CrossFit high Rocks athletes that are you know, we talk to them about their breathing and their sleep and we send them products.

00:30:23
Speaker 2: And and in my head. I’m like, this person’s dialed in, like they’re doing all.

00:30:27
Speaker 1: The right things consistent, like they’re they’re maxing out the performance, and you don’t think they’re going to get that big of an outcome or increase in performance or sleep performance, and all of a sudden, like their numbers are off the charts. And I think the piece that’s overlooked is the psychological side. And so when you’re breathing out of your nose, like our breath is a direct link to our nervous system, same with when you’re out there like hunting, whatever you’re doing. And so when your breath is controlled, when you have longer exhales than your inhales, you’re relaxing your nervous system. And when you’re going to sleep, you really want to relax more than any other time in the day. And so I think what happens is we all know, you know, breath work has become super popular.

00:31:07
Speaker 2: It’s a little overwhelming your breathork like what are we about to do? Like is there gonna be a gong and like.

00:31:11
Speaker 1: Sitney Circle and everyone’s kind of like, I don’t want to do that, and most people don’t. I was somebody like that but I think what the mouth tape does is it forces you. It backs you into breath work. It forces you to slow down your breath. You have to relax, you start breathing slower, and you essentially get the benefits from breath work without having to intentionally do it right. And people don’t actually utilize their breath other than that time, and so you have these high level athletes that are doing all the right things, but from the psychological side, they’ve never used their breath to control the nervous system. So they’ll become more relaxed than they ever have, and I think that’s why it works so well. And then you reduce the resistance with the nail strip and you’re in a really good environment for sleeping. So it’s not that crazy of an idea. It’s just like you tape on your mouth is super weird.

00:31:54
Speaker 3: The control thing, and it’s exactly you know, it’s be super handy and shooting too probably or situations your an animal comes out and your nervous system is and you’re hearing all these different inputs to be able to control that. It’s just another layer of something that you can control.

00:32:09
Speaker 1: They’ve done some sleep studies too, with competitive shooting. Yeah, just I mean it’s exactly what you think would happen. Is is like obviously stability, decision making, like everything it goes down, like the direct correlation between hours of sleep. The more sleep to bribe you are, the worse your accuracy gets. But I think what’s like what’s hard to sleep is people think I’ll be, Okay, I can out tough it, and like you can out tough like the feeling of being tired. Sure, like you can be like you know, I’m gonna work out, but you can’t out tough the things like reaction time, decision making, you know, emotional stability, injury, yeah, yeah, all the accuracy like all that, Yeah, you can’t control that stuff. And I think injury too. It’s like it’s not just your muscles are recovering, it’s your brain’s ability to react to like environment, space, like your spatial awareness, appropriate reception, and so like you can out tough that you can be the most badass dude on the planet, but your brain isn’t functioning how it should be. So I think people think that like they can push through, but it just doesn’t work.

00:33:08
Speaker 5: No.

00:33:09
Speaker 3: I mean I’ve said from the beginning that sleep is probably like the one thing non negotiable for me when it comes to recovery was sleep, you know, and that was the hardest part was you.

00:33:17
Speaker 1: Were ahead of the curb too though, like like you were you were committed to sleep.

00:33:21
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, yeah, before it was like a huge thing. Yeah.

00:33:25
Speaker 3: No, I think sleep was like the main thing that kept me healthy through all those years. Yeah, and honestly, it didn’t really get hurt until we had two kids.

00:33:33
Speaker 5: Yeah.

00:33:34
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:33:34
Speaker 1: Like my wife, she had a two time Olympian swimming and she used to sleep. She’d sleep eleven hours, yeah, and then she’d take an hour and nap between practice because they have two practices a day. And yeah, it’s it’s funny when you look back. I think a lot of people before sleep had all this attention. The people that tend to be the best athletes in the world happened to sleep really well. Like I think, I don’t think they knew why it was helping or exactly had a plan, But I don’t think that’s a coincidence. Like if you were only sleeping six hours the entire.

00:34:04
Speaker 5: Time, you could do that.

00:34:05
Speaker 3: No way I could do it now, Yeah, you know.

00:34:09
Speaker 2: Especially now that you’re sick and yeah, no, no, that I’m sick for sure.

00:34:12
Speaker 6: So how did you what was the issue that was happening where you decided to start trying the nasal strips or the tape Seven years ago, I.

00:34:20
Speaker 1: Didn’t have any so so I originally wanted to be a strength conditioning coach and I started training people, and I was training a bunch of athletes and all torts of different people. And then I spent time like ten years ago with this sleep doctor at UCLA, and this was before any was talking about sleep performance, and I was like, man, if my goal is to help people perform at the highest level, it’s really hard for me not to think that sleep should be the first conversation I’m having. And that was That’s kind of started the journey going back to school, learning more, and then going down to sleep route, you know, head on. And so there was a book written by James Nester. It’s called Breath and he really did.

00:34:56
Speaker 2: A deep dive.

00:34:56
Speaker 1: It’s amazing book, super easy to read it, touch it, it’s like a it’s not it’s not a super technical book, but and he dove into all the studies and science behind nasal breathing and it was fascinating all the science and he did really have a piecing it all together. And so from that I started doing some just experimentation, learning about it, trying and just with regular tape, and then realized there wasn’t really a lot of products out there, and then it kind of evolved from that. So it was a combination of you know, inspiration from new science and then self exploration. But you know, I think breath is so overlooked, and I was one of those people that’s like, I don’t want to do breath work. This is annoying. It’s like weird, I can’t keep my attention, and so it you know, like you get all the benefits of that without having to do it right. And so then it evolved too because it was like, you know, guys like you know, like crossfits a great example of there’s not really a brand that makes sleep products that are geared towards athletes like that or football. You know, we were a lot of football teams and NFL teams with products. It’s like most of sleep masks back then were pink silk sleep mask. Instead trying to create a brand that was performance oriented, that you know, high performance, like like making it acceptable for high performance, to prioritize sleep, because up until five years ago, it was like sleep when you’re dead. It almost looked soft if you were sleeping and prioritizing sleep before. That’s why everyone thought you were asleep. You were soft back in the day. Yeah, it was still.

00:36:21
Speaker 6: Will you will you force like nasal or nasal breathing and.

00:36:25
Speaker 1: Training, Uh yeah, certain types, yeah, but in general just being intentional with it up until a certain point. But yeah, a lot of people do, like zone to nasal breathing. Only some people tape their mouth when they’re doing like long woods and stuff. I don’t take their mouth. I’ll do nasal breathing for sure. But if you’re sick, nasal shrip will change your.

00:36:45
Speaker 2: Life, dude.

00:36:47
Speaker 1: I’m honestly the best, the best, like if you’re stuffy and the other thing on, like it’s I needed.

00:36:53
Speaker 6: That this year when we were in Colorado.

00:36:55
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, my nose.

00:36:57
Speaker 6: My nose was more blocked up than I think it’s ever been.

00:37:00
Speaker 1: It’s nothing worse. And then you can’t sleep at all. I think half the time when you’re sick, you feel bad because you can’t sleep.

00:37:06
Speaker 5: There you go tonight. Yeah, I don’t have any nasal tried one on. I’ve not tried this one.

00:37:10
Speaker 2: Yet, throwing on there, I’ll put it on you.

00:37:13
Speaker 5: All right, we’ll do it. Will we work out?

00:37:15
Speaker 2: Yeah?

00:37:17
Speaker 5: But yeah, I.

00:37:17
Speaker 3: Thought about you on one third Friday when I got real sick, yeah, and had like the aches.

00:37:22
Speaker 5: And full sweats and all that.

00:37:24
Speaker 3: I was like, that’s just what Scott felt like on the side of that mountain that one day.

00:37:27
Speaker 6: That’s a bad place to be, said.

00:37:28
Speaker 1: I got it when I was in Finland, So yeah, Drake was it was so bad, dude. So we went so first off, when we went to Finland, I’m like, oh, I’ve super hell, it’s the happiest country in the world. Yeah, that doesn’t mean friendliest country. Those are two different things, I realized. But yeah, I’m like, I’m gonna have the healthiest week ever. We’re doing twenty five saunas. Like I’m going to come back feel like a million bucks. Every place we went, people are just hammering beers, Like every sauna beers, beers, beers, sausages in the sauna beers And I’m like, so we went out out and uh we went we went out to a karaoke bar and everyone just got like really out of control, and uh, we had a lot of drinks and then I woke up.

00:38:09
Speaker 2: And I’m like, I’m going to die.

00:38:11
Speaker 1: But what happened was that I got neurovirus that night, which is like your stomach sick, and I was the first person in our group to get it. So I woke up and I’m like, I’m just I’m being such a bitch right now. Yeah, like I’m I’m dying and we had to go. We went dog sledding the next morning, and I’m like on this dog. So I’m like just absolutely wanted to die. And then I ended up like going to these songs and stuff and my heart rate was like one ten resting heart rate.

00:38:37
Speaker 2: Turned out I had neurovirus.

00:38:38
Speaker 1: Everyone else got to the next like three days, but I probably could have died because I’m in these like two hundred degree song is sick, hungover. It was like the worst worst day of my life.

00:38:47
Speaker 6: So maybe that’s why they’re souning so much. Maybe they’re trying to sweat.

00:38:51
Speaker 1: It was crazy, like we go at eleven am like one beers. I’m like, no, not really, it’s.

00:38:56
Speaker 6: A horrible combination with the song.

00:38:57
Speaker 1: And then they would they would cook the sausages on the song on the rocks, and so it smelled like sausage.

00:39:02
Speaker 2: Sometimes I’m like, this is not the vibe I’m going for.

00:39:05
Speaker 1: Holy well, what’s crazy about? So I was talking about those like the health’s, the longevity studies. The one thing we miss is like we do exactly like what you guys asked.

00:39:15
Speaker 2: How many minutes? Yeah, how many days?

00:39:16
Speaker 5: What they do because they’re like a go do it.

00:39:18
Speaker 1: It’s like like they they think, yes, they think that the sauna is like the source of health and wellness, and they believe that, and then it’s a community thing like families. Like even at like very average apartment complexes, they have a community sauna. Every family books it for an hour usually on Saturdays or Sundays, and they have a family song and they spend time together. They relaxed, and so I think, like it’s hard to extract the outcomes from that and not have the mindset. Yeah, like everything surrounding the sauna plays a big role, and they manage to stressed really well because of how they think of this stuff. So I don’t think sitting in a hot box for twenty minutes like I think they’re not independent of each other.

00:39:55
Speaker 5: Yeah, I was about to say, there’s a lot of a lot of causation.

00:39:57
Speaker 1: It can be stressed out of your mind and just send the sauna and expect all that to go away.

00:40:01
Speaker 5: Exactly.

00:40:01
Speaker 3: It’s like what I was saying, you know, like I take my two spin drifts.

00:40:04
Speaker 5: Down there in the morning, maybe a nice coffee.

00:40:06
Speaker 2: If I have it that you go through the spin drift.

00:40:08
Speaker 5: Yah, it’s usually my go to keep drink playing water.

00:40:12
Speaker 2: I’ll drink I’m not a big I hate playing water.

00:40:15
Speaker 6: I’ve never seen you drink playing water in my life.

00:40:16
Speaker 2: I’m a big of Lacroix guy.

00:40:17
Speaker 6: Outside of hunting, you’ll drink it when we hunt. I’ve never seen it outside of the restaurants.

00:40:22
Speaker 2: Okay, do you get sparkling water if it’s available?

00:40:25
Speaker 5: Really flat man, I wasn’t.

00:40:27
Speaker 3: I actually hate sparkling water unless it’s unless it’s soon drift.

00:40:32
Speaker 5: I don’t like, I hate Lacroix.

00:40:34
Speaker 2: I can’t do the like fake What about like a like a ollipop?

00:40:38
Speaker 5: Uh? Those are basically just soda.

00:40:40
Speaker 2: Yeah, but it’s like yeah, yeah.

00:40:43
Speaker 5: Like.

00:40:45
Speaker 2: From Michigan.

00:40:46
Speaker 6: I never called it pop because I thought it sounded stupid, and so I always called it soda.

00:40:50
Speaker 1: I never thought it sounded stupid, but then when you get away from it a little bit, like it kind of sounds like I don’t know, I.

00:40:55
Speaker 2: Just call it coked, you know, like soda.

00:40:59
Speaker 3: Usually Yeah, no, I so yeah, I’ll usually go two spin dress and then like I said, I’ll listen to a book.

00:41:04
Speaker 2: Or have you ever worn the hats?

00:41:07
Speaker 5: No?

00:41:07
Speaker 1: That the sweat sensors. No, we just got a new sponsor. It’s like Nicks. It’s it’s so cool. So you wear this sensor. It’s bluetooth and it literally measures real time fluid loss and so.

00:41:18
Speaker 3: So it’s like a real time sweat tast Yeah, they need to send me that canet heavy heavy sweat.

00:41:23
Speaker 1: So I sweat like like seventy one and seventy percent of the average person, which makes sense because I can stand the song on a long time. Yeah, which, the better you sweat usually the better. I’m sure you’re probably the same way I am.

00:41:34
Speaker 5: So hot run, which is.

00:41:36
Speaker 1: Probably why you were able to like keep pushing like in those environments.

00:41:39
Speaker 3: Like I immediately when I start working out, or if I’m in the song or for two minutes.

00:41:43
Speaker 5: Yeah, Like we did a video the other day.

00:41:45
Speaker 3: It’s a uh, pumped the giveaway and I just sat in there for like two minutes and it was already like lathered up.

00:41:51
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:41:52
Speaker 1: When we were driving into town, I thought you’d have all the roads renamed after you.

00:41:55
Speaker 2: You only have the one one.

00:41:57
Speaker 5: Yeah, that’s technically it’s my dad’s so I sell people.

00:42:01
Speaker 6: Yeah. We both sweat enough to wear when we were rifle hunting, and it was October yeah, yeah, so it was like what forties or fifties. Oh, and we would intentionally if we had like a thousand foot climb, we would intentionally wear like a T shirt because once we got there, it’d be we both sweated all the way through. Just take off that layer, put on all new, like warm layers.

00:42:23
Speaker 5: I ended up just wearing a orange vest the one day.

00:42:26
Speaker 6: Yeah, plain orange vests.

00:42:27
Speaker 5: We climbed like a thousand feet in what less than a mile, Yeah, and it was just it was miserable hot. Yeah.

00:42:34
Speaker 6: And I remember, actually we’d go into sweating a lot. Two years or three years ago, we when we were in Idaho rifle hunting, we had this really hard climb out of it was like our fourth day when we saw that stuff. Oh yeah, and we’d sweated through our pants even like the pants were soaked through, like you can wring them out.

00:42:53
Speaker 1: Yeah, so that’s what’s that’s what’s interesting with like measuring how many like to let you’re losing is like in any type of competition in the environment like that, you really you really have no idea, Like I couldn’t have guessed within ten outs of how much fluid I lost or how much electrolytes. So you know, for athletes, I feel like it’s that’s a valuable tool to be able to figure out exactly what your balance is because I don’t think people realize that you can dehydrate yourself from drinking too much water.

00:43:18
Speaker 2: That’s that balance. Yeah.

00:43:20
Speaker 1: So and I back to sleep, like hydration is people mess up their sleep with hydration a lot with just their strategy.

00:43:28
Speaker 5: I was about, say, being two hydrated and they backload it.

00:43:31
Speaker 1: Yeah, and it’s like you really want majority of your fluid intake the first half of the day unless you’re doing something crazy at night. But you know, rule with them, we usually say like no food, like the three two one, no food three hours before bed, no no fluids two hours, and then no screens one hour.

00:43:45
Speaker 2: That’s a pretty good rule. But yeah, the fluid.

00:43:48
Speaker 1: Is like not only just how much you’re having, how you’re drinking it. So like if you drink more than five ounces, like you gulped down five ounces, like your body is trying to maintain that balance but electrolyte, so it’s going to trigger you to go to the bathroom more often. I got to get up in the middle of the night. So a lot of times, honestly, when people front load their hydration, they wake up way less often because, uh, you know, every time you wake up in the middle of the night, it’s an opportunity for you to potentially not fall back to sleep.

00:44:12
Speaker 2: Sleep.

00:44:13
Speaker 1: So you can limit if you can do everything in your power to limit that beyond you know, the natural and waking up one one time to go to math umber two.

00:44:20
Speaker 2: You should do that.

00:44:20
Speaker 1: If you’re waking up three or four times, it’s like, you know, think about your hydration strategy.

00:44:25
Speaker 5: Usually one.

00:44:26
Speaker 6: Sometimes I’m an outlier because I will drink a lot. I work out in the afternoon and so I’m super tough, thirsty after and I drink so much liquid at night. I’m talking like before I late, I’m standing at my bedside table. I will drink like ten hours of water, I lay down in bed, I do not. Maybe ten times a year I wake up to pee in the middle of Wow. Yeah, I never have to go.

00:44:47
Speaker 2: Do you where a whoop or ye? Woo? Is it you must have a great sleep score?

00:44:52
Speaker 6: Yeah? Usually every if I’m if I’m not like traveling or hunting or something like that, I’m basically in a green every day, and my sleep’s all almost like yeah.

00:45:02
Speaker 1: Yeah, I like the sleep score a lot more because the green is tough. Yeah, I get so many questions about being in the green. And it’s like, you know, whoop is a self correcting algorithm. So if you hit ninety eight percent recovery in the green and your biometrics the exact same every day for like years, that will that ninety eight will start becoming closer and closer to fifty. Eventually you’ll be in the yellow with the same biometrics, so, you know, because it corrects itself. Sometimes people expect to be in the green, but realistically, the majority of your days, even if you were, if you’re super consistent recovering well and there’s not these like crazy outliers, like most of your days will be in the high level of yellows like those sixties.

00:45:40
Speaker 2: Are are great.

00:45:41
Speaker 1: That’s a normal day, and I think people shouldn’t look at that green as like good.

00:45:46
Speaker 3: That’s not how I was at a one percent on Saturday. Yeah, obviously it was like flew night and then I’ve been in every day since and feeling like crap.

00:45:55
Speaker 6: Yeah, it’s just because you’re resting.

00:45:57
Speaker 5: Probably, Yeah, I got nine hours of sleep last night, So.

00:46:00
Speaker 2: I wonder what your HIV was on that day. Totally trash.

00:46:03
Speaker 5: That good that.

00:46:06
Speaker 6: Doing some sort of sweat test. I think even like thinking about like a backcountry hunting application, Yeah, super important because if you’re packing for a seven or ten day hunt and you know exactly yeah, I mean it’s not gonna be perfect, but you know, if you’re having a high output of activity how much, yeah, like you’re losing per hour or whatever, I think that’d be super beneficial.

00:46:26
Speaker 1: Definitely, we’ve we’ve worked The other tool we’ve worked with some for hunts is the sleep mask. Because of the light environments, which you’re normal.

00:46:35
Speaker 3: On a day like today when I’m eighty six percent is ninety seven.

00:46:41
Speaker 1: Yeah, my wife’s back, and when you’re swimming there’s like one eight one ninety really yeah, crazy.

00:46:47
Speaker 2: Sorry, Michael Philson’s was like two fifty. That’s crazy.

00:46:52
Speaker 1: But yeah, like the mask, you know, because a lot of hunts there’s like the lighting environment. You never know, depending can be super light or dark, and so sometimes when you get used to that, like every night, it’s like a psychological trigger. At least you can replicate that environment when you’re out wherever you are.

00:47:08
Speaker 2: That can be a useful tool.

00:47:09
Speaker 1: We recommend that lot to athletes because you know, when you’re on the road, if you’re in a hotel, you can’t predict the situation. Yeah, so it’s like, okay, how can we control the most things possible? And so you know, with the mask, it’s like you can replicate that environment anywhere you go.

00:47:23
Speaker 2: Apply to hunts too.

00:47:25
Speaker 5: Yeah, man, I hate any type of light whatsoever?

00:47:28
Speaker 2: Do you use a mask r now? No?

00:47:30
Speaker 5: Half the time.

00:47:31
Speaker 3: I tried it for a while and I’ll just push it off in the middle of the night. Yeah, I’d start the night with it.

00:47:37
Speaker 1: But it’s tough though when you go somewhere probably, Yeah, And that’s kind of where it’s like with with you know, athletes, especially like competitive competitive athletes.

00:47:45
Speaker 2: It’s it’s like you you can’t risk that.

00:47:47
Speaker 6: No, the light doesn’t bother me either. I’m starting to think I just sleep well as like an outliers, noting to do. The only thing I do properly, I think is the timing, like I go to bed at the same time, have the same time.

00:48:00
Speaker 1: But like like that, So like a lot of people are where you’re at right, and they they think of sleep as as like fitness, where you can continue to get better and optimize it, right, And it’s like sleep is.

00:48:11
Speaker 2: One of those things.

00:48:12
Speaker 1: If you’re getting the right quantity, you feel like getting good quality and you wake up in the morning have energy, and you feel good like great, keep doing what you’re doing, like you don’t want to over you can overthink yourself into getting bad sleep. You start thinking about metrics and how you can make it better. Like just because you have the perfect temperature and routine, that doesn’t mean your actual sleep quality is better. Right, So if you feel good, like check the box, move on. It’s not a linear progression like it is, you know, endurance. Yeah, Like it’s I think thinking about that.

00:48:39
Speaker 6: I think what you bringing up like, I think the biggest thing that I would say is affected sleep in my life is like talking about the life stresses. Yeah, like I think because I don’t have much stress, that’s probably what’s doing it. Because I definitely don’t follow the three two one rule the only and I’m active and I go to bed and wake up at the same time.

00:48:58
Speaker 1: But those those are like the two biggest things, you know, Like, yeah, I mean you manage your stress, you’re consistent, and you’re you have a healthy lifestyle. I mean those are the big rocks and the other stuff everyone likes to talk about. But at the end of the day, everything falls in place sometimes when the other things are working.

00:49:17
Speaker 5: Well.

00:49:17
Speaker 3: Cool dude, Yeah, I think you know two main there’s almost like two subsets that takeaway have purpose.

00:49:23
Speaker 5: Yeah, get rid of the stress in your life.

00:49:25
Speaker 2: Yeah, you don’t have that, those two things.

00:49:27
Speaker 3: But then I think the three to two to one thing is super beneficial, just a practical thing that people can try if they are you know, like, hey man, I’ll work out pretty regularly.

00:49:35
Speaker 5: I manage my stress. Well.

00:49:37
Speaker 3: I think we all have stress in our life that sometimes creeps up. But then I think that three to two one, So say that again.

00:49:43
Speaker 1: So no food three hours before bed, no water two hours, then no screens one hour and screens are tough, Like that’s why, like if there’s some glasses out there you can use, because sometimes it’s unrealistic, but if you’re going to use them, like yeah, do you use something to block some of that light?

00:49:58
Speaker 2: Yeah?

00:49:58
Speaker 5: Cool, and then they can check you out.

00:50:01
Speaker 1: Yeah, dream recovery, the nasal strips. I mean if if you’re snoring, a lot of guys especially like snoring, get at home sleep test and if you are, like super useful tool.

00:50:11
Speaker 5: Yeah, good for sleep and good for fitness.

00:50:13
Speaker 2: Right yeah, definitely.

00:50:14
Speaker 1: Well, I mean that’s honestly like people like you know, like right now high rocks, like people wearing nail strips like crazy. But the real use case would be like a hike or something where it’s kind of like that lower level intensity being breathed through your nose the whole time you’ll lose, You’ll you’ll use less energy throughout the entire duration, so keeping your heart rate low, especially like on a big hike hunt that could be a useful.

00:50:34
Speaker 2: Tool because a lot of people want to breathe well

00:50:36
Speaker 1: Through their nose and that’s how you want to be breathing, especially if you’re carrying gear or whatever.